Rural Venture Collective
Supported by the Victorian Government, this is a podcast about women living their lives in rural East Gippsland. Connecting business women across the region by telling their stories - their challenges, their achievements, their everyday lives.
This podcast is proudly brought to you by EGMI (East Gippsland Marketing Inc) with funding by the Victorian Government. Episodes are recorded at the James Yeates Studio, Bairnsdale.
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Rural Venture Collective
Breaking the Stigma: A Conversation on Mental Health with Karen Tough
What is mental health to you? Are you comfortable discussing it? Ever felt like a fraud despite your achievements? All too often, these questions are swept under the rug, but we dive into these stigmatised topics head-on with the inspiring Karen Tough. A mother, social worker, and mental health clinician based in East Gippsland, Karen bravely shares her journey into mental health and how it shaped her life and business, Lighthouse Mental Health. She challenges common misconceptions about mental health and illness, highlighting how it's a continuum of experiences that impacts us all.
Tune in to hear Karen's motivational story and gain valuable insights into mental health.
Welcome to the Rural Venture Collective podcast. The podcast will show that celebrates the strength, innovation and resilience of women across East Gippsland. Whether you're a local resident or someone curious about the unique spirit of East Gippsland, this podcast is for you. Together, we'll explore the triumphs, the lessons learned and the dreams that fuel these East Gippsland women. Through this podcast, we'll dive into the heart of East Gippsland and shine a spotlight on the incredible women who are shaping business, creating art, nurturing the land and fostering connections across this vast region. Get ready to be inspired, to learn and to be a part of a collection that celebrates the shared experiences that make East Gippsland more than just a place but a home. So grab a cup of your favourite local brew, find a cosy spot and tune in as we embark on a journey of connection and discovery together. I'd like to acknowledge the Gunnye Kurnye people as the traditional owners of the land on which we are gathered and pay my respects to their elders, past, present and future.
Speaker 1:Hello everyone, and welcome to the Rural Venture Collective. I'm your host, liz Whitehill, and I am delighted to welcome today's guest, karen Tuff. Karen's a social worker, a mum, active member of the East Gippsland community and a positivity powerhouse. So let's give a big Rural welcome to Karen Tuff. Hey, karen, good morning Liz. Thank you for having me. Thanks for joining us in the studio today. I'm super keen to get things started and find out more about you. So let's get cracking, shall we?
Speaker 2:A reminder that this episode contains discussions about suicide and mental illness that may cause emotional distress or discomfort. This warning is simply to empower you our audience with the knowledge you need to make healthy decisions about how and if you consume this podcast content. If you or someone you know need support, please call Lifeline on 131114.
Speaker 1:There's a lot going on in your life right now, so tell me a little bit about what it is that you do.
Speaker 3:Okay, so, apart from being a mum of three, I am a social worker and a mental health clinician and I have recently opened a business called Lighthouse Mental Health. I saw a need in the community for people who have mental illness and who are in what we call the recovery stage of their illness, which is where they want to be able to live their best life with the best supports and have good people and good experiences around them. So I opened the door approximately five months ago on my own and I think, given the experiences of East Gippsland over the past three years, I saw an absolute need for people to have good quality supports. So we've just opened an office in Main Street and we have clients who have significant mental illness and who want to live their best lives, and that's what we're providing on a daily basis is those supports for them to do that.
Speaker 1:So mental health awareness has come a long way, right, but there's still some misconceptions out there. What are common myths about mental illness?
Speaker 3:I think when people think of mental health, I do hear people say that they don't have mental health issues or you know they don't experience anything with their mental health. But mental health is a continuum and it is about, you know, the ups, the downs in life, the joys we experience, the happiness. And when we are looking at that continuum, it is about when life is going great, our mental health and well-being is good because we can live life, we're proactive, we connect with people. But when there is the other end of the spectrum, when there's mental illness, this is where people have those episodes of illness and they will have a diagnosis, for example, schizophrenia or depression, anxiety. It's about people being able to obtain the right supports in that space and I think, given the experiences of East Gippsland in the last couple of years, or even three years with the horrific bushfires we had then the COVID lockdown, I think this is actually brought to light what people are experiencing in life and that their mental health is struggling, and it can be about finding the people to talk to and you know if you're feeling a bit low, we all have mental health.
Speaker 3:It's how we can get the support with it, whereas mental illness is part of mental health. It's just having those experiences where you don't perhaps function as well in life. So I think, being able to explain to people that we can have these conversations about mental health and it's not to do anymore, and trying to change the stigma and the judgment around people that experience those episodes of acute mental illness. So I mean, if I think, if I look at my own mental health, I have to make sure that I'm doing all the right things in my life and looking at am I exercising, am I eating, am I resting, am I talking to people and you know there are days where I don't have good moments myself. So and that's all part of my mental health.
Speaker 1:So where does somebody who's in the mental health profession and who's a pillar of the community and I'm sure is, turned to both professionally and personally? I'm sure you have friends who turn to you when they're in need. Where does the professional turn when they need some support?
Speaker 3:So, for me, being a social worker, part of my registration is that I have to have supervision from someone who is more experienced than myself. So I actually have a mental health accredited social worker and who has significant experience in the mental health space, and I have a supervision session with her once a month, and that's not just about my work but it's about my life, where I get to chat about things that are perhaps worrying me, but I get to chat about the things that are going really well, to which is really important, because that needs to be a focus for our mental health, not just the negativity or the things that are going wrong. It's nice to be able to talk about the things that are going well. Part of that as well, I think, given we experienced COVID and a lot of things went online. We went to telehealth, we went to Zooms and being able to reach out and connect to other options online and my partner, obviously, being able to talk to my husband.
Speaker 3:And I think, the biggest key for me which is something I learned years ago working in mental health the key is conversation. If you can have a conversation, that can begin your healing. It can let you offload things, but it can let you have someone use someone as a sounding board just to bounce things off. So conversation, whether it's telehealth, over the phone, and sometimes even with yourself, can help too.
Speaker 1:Well, that's what the Rural Venture Collective is all about. It's all about conversations, it's all about connecting and it's all about people listening, taking advice that they might need or sharing with others. On that note, what's the best advice you've been given along the way?
Speaker 3:The best advice for me I think definitely the conversation and I hear this a lot and I probably mirror this to my clients is that you have to put yourself first. You are number one in your space. If you're married, if you've got children, if you're looking after parents, you still have to put yourself first, because if you don't fill your own cup, then you've got nothing to give and, as we all know, you get on the aeroplane, the air mask drops. We have to look after ourselves, but if we're full and we've got enough going on for ourselves, that energy and that ripple effect goes out to those around us and they will mirror us and we've then got the strength to go and support other people. So it's definitely put yourself first. It is so important.
Speaker 1:It is important and it is a tough lesson to learn, isn't it? You've referred to your husband and your children. Tell us, karen, how do you balance a busy work life and a busy home life, and I think you have teenage children.
Speaker 3:Yes, three teenagers. So it's funny. I look at that statement the work life balance and I don't know if that is such a thing. I think for me it's about focusing on what's important at the time For me at the moment I've got three teenage kids, so they're reasonably self-sufficient apart from emptying the dishwasher and doing the dishes. But for me, my focus at the moment is this business and it's about building the capacity in my space and around my business so I get to support others in the community who are struggling. So I think it's that ebb and flow and sometimes you will do more at home and you'll stay more at home, and other times the pool will come from the business or there's that pool from friends and family. So I think it's the balance that works for you, not necessarily for anyone else.
Speaker 1:Well, can I quote you, Karen, for sure. Positive psychology is looking at joy, happiness, gratitude and, most importantly, our strengths and how we can cultivate more of this. Any tips on how we achieve this?
Speaker 3:Okay. So for me, I think you need to really find out what's important for you and what do you enjoy. And when we look at people's values and that can be a hard thing to do for people to go well, why are we doing the things we're doing? And values, when we look at those, will usually guide us in that way. So if I was to ask you, liz, what's your top three values in life?
Speaker 1:Well, family sleep? It depends on the day. Sometimes it's wine.
Speaker 3:It's interesting and your values will change. If you can understand why you're doing what you're doing, I think it helps you achieve. I read a book quite a few years ago by Dr Crade. He's a GP, senior lecturer at Monash Health. He talks about what are the things we need to do to live our best life, to be happy to be, to get through things as well, and when I look at the Pillars of Health, craig talks about the essential things in life, which is making sure that we're getting the right food and drinking plenty of water, which we all need to do a little bit more of.
Speaker 3:It's also exercise Are we moving our bodies? And it's not doing the marathons, the aerobics or the big hit classes, but it's are we actually taking time to walk and do things that actually get us out of the house? And we can do all these things without going. Its exercise. We can just be in nature. So it's just about moving our bodies and for me, it's really looking at those. How can you do those really basic needs and doing those and making sure that you do that well, if you can have an understanding of what drives you, why you're doing it and making sure you do all those really simple things to begin with.
Speaker 1:Sounds great. So East Skipsland has a plethora of community support groups pitched to all different people and interests. In fact, the very first time you and I met, we were sitting next to one another in one of these groups.
Speaker 3:Yes, we were.
Speaker 1:I've read about sister circles. What exactly is a sister circle? Can you break that down for our listeners?
Speaker 3:So it can be called a women's circle. It can be called a sister circle. I now refer to them as a women's circle. For me, it's about connecting women in a very spiritual space, and I'm quite a spiritual person. I like to read about all types of religions, and particularly Buddhism and Hinduism, and a circle is about having that connection with people and the reason we do it in circles. So there's no beginning, there's no end, there's no one at the head, there's no one behind. We are in an equal playing field, and part of that for me is being able to get women together.
Speaker 3:I think as women, we do things probably quite differently to men in a lot of aspects, and one of them is our ability to share and to get really deep and quite vulnerable.
Speaker 3:And if any of your listeners have ever listened to or read Renee Brown, she's the queen of vulnerability and that's been her research throughout life.
Speaker 3:And part of that for me doing these women's circles is about getting women to be vulnerable and to open up and let themselves talk about things that perhaps they wouldn't talk about with other people or with their partners, and part of it is just really making that connection together as women and being able to explore what's bringing a joy, what's bringing a happiness, and really exploring that when we talk about happiness and joy.
Speaker 3:Happiness are the things that we do that make us laugh or bring us that instant sort of type of gratification, whereas the joy is the thing we do that brings a sustained impact and something that will be long term in that joyful space.
Speaker 3:So in the circles, it's really giving women that opportunity to let go and to explore the joy and the happiness, but to also look at that shame and that vulnerability and perhaps some of the guilt that we hold on to, because as women, we can do it all, but there's times that we need to stop doing it all. So I like to be able to give women that space where they can really tap into what's holding them back, what's dragging them down, what's making them sad, and I like to do that in a really connected space with beautiful words and poetry and things to make you really think, also to give time just for you, because again this comes back to you You've got to be the most important person in your world. So I like connecting women who are very light-minded on the same path, and it's also about the energy that we will bring together as well as women.
Speaker 1:You refer to women being able to do it all. And we can and we do, but that brings with it all that pressure of being the best at what we do. We want to be the best at everything we do, and if we're doing everything, how can we be the best at what we do? And sometimes I feel that pressure comes from within. It comes from us 100%.
Speaker 3:So I did my psychology degree. I did an undergrad with my three children I think I had three under four when I went I'm going to do something different in life and finished my psychology degree and didn't feel that I was worthy enough or that I knew enough to go out and work in this space. So sat back for quite a few years. And it's quite ironic, I feel I've come full circle, because I actually worked for East Kippsland marking many years ago and I just didn't believe that I knew enough and I couldn't do it. So eventually I did get into the mental health space but I felt that I still didn't know enough and I wasn't qualified or I wasn't good enough. So hence moving on to my second degree. So I got my masters in social work and got the qualifications, did this through COVID. So it was a fascinating space to actually learn about this and finish that degree and I still feel like I didn't know enough, still didn't feel that I had all the answers, the qualifications, who am I to be able to teach and guide and support and nurture other people with mental health issues in this space? So then I moved on to my next job and worked in the acute mental health setting, so dealing with the really what we call the pointy end of mental health, and still didn't think that I knew enough, and always wanting to do more and doing the next course and the next little workshop to learn more about people with mental health. But then I'd have these moments of absolute clarity where someone would mirror back to me and go that I'd changed their life, or I was there to support them, or I saved their lives. And because I think, as we know in the mental health space, that suicide is quite high amongst our population at the moment and if we look at the statistics around the world, depression is the number one mental illness worldwide and it's increasing. I think that says a lot about our community and about the world, when depression is the number one mental illness in the world.
Speaker 3:So for me, again I'm going do I know enough? How can I do this? And I need to learn more and I need to do more. So again, I'm on degree number three at the moment and after learning all about the deficit, the negative, which we do when we're looking at psychology in that space, I went well, how do we teach people to do as best as they can? So hence why I'm now doing my positive psychology degree, but I think at some point I went. I think I know enough that I can now actually get out and help other people. But as a mum, as a wife, as a business owner, I do recognise that sometimes it's okay to slow down and that I don't always have the answers and I don't know everything. But it's about doing the best I can with what I've got and trying to help where I can. The other day I had a moment where I just went what am I doing? Who am I to be in this space and who am I to be running my own business?
Speaker 1:So I think a lot of people resonate with what you're saying, Karen, and what I'm hearing you describe is what I believe is called imposter syndrome. Is that right?
Speaker 3:Oh, yes, I think we all know that word and it is, and it's about doubting what we know and what we can do, and I think, as women, we do put a lot of pressure on ourselves to be the best, to be able to do everything, and it's not something that I think serves us in any way, and I actually think it's a word that we should remove.
Speaker 3:And the other word we need to remove from the English language is should. I shouldn't do this and I should do that and I should, I think. Why can't we just jump in boots and all and just have a crack and do everything and see what works and what doesn't work? A big part of the reason I jumped into studying Lighthouse Mental Health was because I actually made a mistake, and it was something a mistake that I made and that it actually changed the trajectory of my life earlier this year. And making that mistake enabled me to see things differently and I think it probably removed that imposter syndrome component, because I was probably trying to be like everyone else and follow what all the other mental health clinicians were doing and all the other workers were doing, and I think it actually gave me the permission to move forward and to do something in lives.
Speaker 1:So tell us a bit more about your story, Karen. How did you become involved in mental health?
Speaker 3:So there's a couple of different facets to this. On my own mental health journey throughout life, I, like a lot of other people, have had lots of ups and downs in life. I've had periods where things haven't gone to plan or things haven't gone well, and there has been time as I've reached out to counsellors and psychologists I think the biggest turning point for me. My best friend has a diagnosis of anorexia nervosa. She's also been suicidal on and off for 25 years and sitting with her in that space and watching her go through that journey and being privy to the psych wards, the psychologist, the psychiatrist and just watching her journey and how she navigated that space and part of that connection with her, given that she was in mental health psychiatry wards for quite a long time we spent hours and hours on the phone. I think one of our longest conversations was eight hours on the phone and it gave me an absolute insight into what she was experiencing and over the years I was able to discover with her what worked for her, what didn't work for her and one of the biggest findings for me out of there was just those positive psychology type of conversations about building her belief in herself and trying to change her mindset and I think I was delivering CBT, which is cognitive behaviour therapy, without actually knowing what it was. So, sitting in that journey with her and actually watching it and listening to it, and there was some pretty horrific moments with her, given that she was suicidal for such a long time I thought, well, I think I know a little bit now, so I'm going to start exploring it. And I think the other part for me as well was trying to understand my own mental health, because I'd had such low periods in my own time. I'm not ashamed or scared to say that I have tried to commit suicide before and I've had periods where things weren't great. My dad's a Vietnam veteran and if anyone has a veteran as a father, they can probably understand that there's times where things aren't going the best and it can be quite a hard space to sit in. So a lot of my thought processes weren't perhaps as well as they should have been.
Speaker 3:So for me, the reason I began to start to study psychology is because I wanted to understand myself better. I needed to know but also, how do I heal myself? Because everywhere I went it was hard to break down those layers. And I think, as you mentioned before, liz. This is about really looking at yourself and going inside yourself, and part of my job as well, with working with clients. I can give them all the tools in the world, but if you don't take the action and you don't listen and you don't change your own mindset and your thought processes, then you're probably not going to achieve a lot. So for me it was about teaching myself how do I change, and a big problem I had was that I was a very negative thinker.
Speaker 3:The language I used with myself was quite degrading, you know, and I think we've all been guilty of those times where we're going I'm an idiot, or I'm stupid, or I shouldn't have done that, or I'm not good enough. I think that's a big one. We do all have that. I'm not good enough to do anything. And I went. Well, if I tell myself enough, I will believe it, which I did. But I thought what happens if I flip that narrative and start to say, well, I am worthy and I am good enough and I can be a good clinician and I can be a good support for people? So part of my scope of practice now with my clients is really pulling them up and when they're self-deprecating and they're having those negative conversations. Okay, well, what if we start saying that you are good enough and you can do this?
Speaker 1:Well, karen Tuff, I can only thank you for your energy today. You've been in absolute delight and I could literally sit here all day talking to you. Well, that's us for today. Thanks for joining us on the Rural Venture Collective. Remember to like and subscribe so you'll be updated when our next podcast lands. Most importantly, stay connected and get out there and enjoy our beautiful East Skips Land. The Rural Venture Collective podcast is made possible by support from the Victorian Government and East Skips Land Marketing Incorporated.
